Hi there. Lisa here. Before we start the show. I have a few disclaimers that I would like for you to keep in mind as you listen to each episode. First this show will cover a variety of topics related to connection. Mental health work and life. And some of these topics may be sensitive for you or for someone, you know, I want to offer you permission to choose courage over comfort when it comes to consuming sensitive content and also permission to respect your own limits. When it comes to consuming this content, which may be sensitive for you. I also need to indicate that while I am a licensed therapist. I am not your therapist. This show is not intended to be direct professional advice, and you should not use this as a substitute for individualized professional help. Lastly, while I can assure you that any of the coachable or teachable content I share will have demonstrated effectiveness and our practices. I use myself. I can also assure you that I am imperfect. And there are times when I do not act as skillfully as I would have liked. My goal is to act skillfully most of the time. And I very much want that for you too. Now with that said let's start the show Hello, and welcome to wire to connect the startup mental health podcast that keeps you going every week with our easily digestible lessons, skills and stories that you can put into practice immediately. I'm your host, your coach, your teacher, Lisa Birnbaum. I'm also a social worker, a therapist, and the co-founder of strength squared, a therapy coaching and consulting practice for startup founders in their teams that I started with my wife and co-founder in 2021. The learnings we are sharing here, come from a combination of the lived experiences of the startup founders and startup team members. We've worked with over the years. From our own lived experiences. And from research backed strategies too. And we are so excited to be able to share these insights here with all of you now. In today's episode, we'll be discussing Whether your startup has an accurate understanding of what exactly psychological safety is, why it's so important and then how to foster it effectively. Today's episode is going to be a bit different in that my wife and co-founder Marissa will be joining me on the mic today. On a personal note. And as some of our listeners know at the time of this recording, November, 2022. Marissa. And I have two young kids, Maya and Parker. Maya is three and Parker just turned And yes, like many of you, we too are right in the thick of it. As we try to navigate both work and life. Anyway with Parker syllabi, it just felt super hard to have us both on And it's really thanks to Marissa that I've been able to record these episodes at all. There's nothing magical about Parker turning one the other day. He's definitely still a baby who needs constant care, love and attention. It's a milestone though, for sure. And so we wanted to give this a try. Our plan from the beginning was to have us co-host together. And hopefully we'll be able to get there soon. For today though, you'll get to meet Marissa and spend some time with both of us. As we talk through this crucial topic of psychological safety. As I hope you can all appreciate so much of this is interconnected. We're going to break all of this down for you in today's episode. So let's get into it. Let's make some meaningful connections. Support for today's show comes from our very own strength squared. What, if you really knew the type of startup founder you are, or the type of future startup founder you are likely to become, would it change your trajectory? Would you do anything differently? Well, now you can better answer these questions for yourself. By taking the quiz we created specifically for startup founders and future startup founders. In 10 pinpoint questions, you'll identify your leadership strengths as well as your opportunities for growth. At the end, you'll see which type of startup founder you are. Or which type of future startup founder you are likely to become so that you can move forward with the clarity, courage, and confidence. To ensure that your type is working for you rather than against you. Just had to strength, square.com/quiz to take the first step toward being the best startup founder. You can be. That's S T R E N G T H S S Q U a R E d.com. Forward slash quiz. And we can't wait to hear which type of startup founder you are. In today's episode, Marissa and I are talking through what exactly psychological safety is to be sure you have an accurate understanding of it and why it's so important for the success of your startup. Then we'll get into how to establish, build and cultivate that psych safety effectively. And now a long overdue and very warm welcome to my wife and co-founder Marissa Birnbaum. Welcome to the show, Marissa. So excited to have Thanks so much. I'm very happy to be here to provide some context into our topic for today. Why don't we start by having you tell our listeners about Google's now famous research study project Aristotle. Sure. So before I started working with Googlers, Google conducted a multi-year research study. To understand the dynamics that define their most successful teams. What they found was that psychological safety. Which in its most simplistic terms is the belief that you can speak up without the fear of embarrassment or the fear of punishment. Was by far the most important of the dynamics that set their most successful teams apart. I know from my own experiences and from the experiences of my clients. As well as from the research that when psychological safety is experienced on a team, team members then feel safe enough to take risks and to be vulnerable in front of each other, which results in effective collaboration and feedback, healthy, challenging of one, another greater creativity and innovation and stronger connections with each other. Psychological safety is so crucial to the success of a team that it is experienced as more valuable than resources, money, and training. In fact, a lack of psych safety, stifles productivity, creativity, and innovation. It deters risk-taking and perpetuates only harmful competition. Great. Thanks for that. I think at the time of this recording, again, it's November 20, 20, too many people working in tech will have at least heard of psychological safety, which was coined by Harvard business school, professor and researcher, Amy Edmondson, who also gave an excellent Ted talk on the topic. So why do you think more teams haven't focused on providing this kind of support to one another good question. I think there's a few factors at Even after everything that's been written on the topic, there are some who have managed to survive despite skirting the issue. And therefore haven't appreciated its importance or its necessity. There are others who hold the faulty belief that creating this sense of safety would mean having a lack of accountability. When in reality, psychological safety and accountability are not at all mutually exclusive. They are two different dimensions and both are important. Also holding people accountable without them feeling psychologically safe, only breeds a climate of heightened, unnecessary anxiety. There are some who may want to create the sense of safety and don't know where to start. And then there are others who may think they've created this sense of safety and haven't, or perhaps they've created it at some point and haven't cultivated it in an ongoing way. Creating building and cultivating psychological safety takes intention, time and effort. It's not the same as implementing a new software development process or following a checklist to finish a project. What is needed first and foremost is for founders and leaders to really understand what psychological safety is to then model it. By example, starting at the top. And to routinely revisit it as things change and Okay. So Lisa, can you break down psychological safety for us so that our listeners can really understand what it is? And then maybe talk through how you would model it for others. Absolutely the way I think about psychological safety is like this. If I've created a culture on my team that is truly psychologically safe, a few things are not negotiable. First, every single person on my team must genuinely believe that they are empowered to speak up about concerns. And suggest ideas without these negatively impacting them in some This needs to be felt by those who are new to the team. And by those who have been with the company since day one, By those who have worked at a number of other startups and by those who have never worked at a startup by By those who have tons of other work experiences. And by those who are just starting out. And for folks of marginalized identities, I would say this is even more important to ensure modeling this at the top starts by asking everyone something like. What would support from me, look like encouraging each of them to tease out what support would be most And then either ensuring I support them in those ways or that I find a suitable alternative for supporting them. I think it's most useful when this is done by meeting with each team member individually. Some additional and relatively simple questions I'd ask each of them routinely are, how are things What would you like to see change? How can I help and what is something I could do to make things easier on you? Then I keep track of their preferences and use them to build a project schedule and an effective workflow. Next, anyone on my team, including myself who has been around since day one. I genuinely believe that they do not have all the answers that simply because they are doing something that's working doesn't mean that's the only way of doing it. And doesn't mean that's the most desirable way of doing And must be open both to new suggestions ideas and solutions and open to revisiting previous suggestions ideas and solutions Adopting a mindset of I'm here to get it right. Not to be right. Is a necessity. Which can be especially hard for founders and leaders who believe we understand the business better than anyone. Often, this means founders and leaders needing to find creative ways of encouraging others to speak before speaking ourselves, when I've seen founders do this well, they tend to frame the work as a learning problem, not an execution problem. They make explicit, both the enormous uncertainty inherent within startups. As well as the enormous interdependence required of each team. Modeling this at the top could sound like. We don't know exactly how this will turn out. We've got to have everybody's brains and voices in the game. This creates a strong rationale for speaking up. When I've seen founders do this while they also acknowledge their own, valuability modeling this at the top could sound like I may miss something here. I very much want to hear from each This creates an additional sense of safety for speaking Next thing is that everyone on my team. Must demonstrate a willingness to enter into conversations with an open As opposed to already coming to the table with fixed beliefs around what makes for a good idea or a bad idea. And who gets to suggest these ideas in the first place Everyone on my team needs to understand that the idea we wind up going with might come from someone who is more junior. When I've seen founders do this while they ask lots of questions and take an approach of genuine curiosity, which serves as a sort of natural antidote to judgment. Modeling this at the top, it sounds something like, help me understand how you reached this conclusion or. Say more about how you imagine this playing out. This creates a real need for voice and encouragement for speaking up rather than doing or saying something that is likely to silence and facilitate shutting down. Useful starting points for this are structuring meetings in a way that encourages everyone to talk. And allows enough time for everyone to talk that doesn't facilitate or tolerate team members interrupting one another. And that uses active listening skills to ensure an accurate understanding of what's being said, rather than making unnecessary assumptions. And just so our listeners know active listening is where you say back to the person speaking. What you understood to have said, and then you give them an opportunity to confirm or to clarify. This could sound something like, from what I'm hearing, it sounds like you think we have placed too much importance on speed of response time in our SLS. And not enough importance on understanding what each of our customer's actual concerns are. In order to respond in a thoughtful way that actually helps them. I'm also hearing you say that because we've prioritized speed over quality. We've generated additional customer support tickets that don't need to exist in an effort to close more tickets. Am I understanding this correctly. Yes. Excellent. Thanks for jumping in there to demonstrate what active listening sounds like. You're welcome. Why don't you continue with what you believe are the non-negotiables that have to exist in order to create a team culture? And company. Culture that is truly psychologically safe. Right. Thank you. So the last of these non-negotiables is for every single person on a team, regardless of their job title, to engage in behaviors that flatten hierarchy and allow folks to experience being on an even playing field when brainstorming and working through problems. It's crucial that we all consider what types of privilege we hold relative to one And what each of us can do personally to minimize existing power differentials. A helpful reminder is for each person to challenge themselves to either step up or step back prior to entering into any conversation, meeting or interaction, depending on who else is present relative to themselves. Another easy way to engage in behaviors. Aimed at flattening hierarchy during meetings is to share responsibilities. When I've seen founders do this well, they create about four special roles for folks, including themselves to take on during meetings. Basically using a rotating schedule that remains ongoing. Everyone gets a turn in these special roles. My favorite combination I've seen of these four special roles I think is for one person to be responsible for leading everyone in a 10 minute mindfulness practice or gratitude practice to start the meeting One person responsible for facilitating the meaning itself. Meaning holding everyone accountable to their determined agenda and the determined time estimates, and then one person responsible for helping the team notice moments during the meeting where someone might be prioritizing something else over the company's core values. And when I've seen this, it, it wasn't intended to negatively judge shame or blame. Whoever was doing this. It was instead meant to bring awareness to it so that it could be talked about openly and honestly, and then one person responsible for taking notes during the meeting, in the form of, of meeting minutes. In addition to this approach, working to build psychological safety. And extra benefit, a ripple effect that often results from this is that team members who typically have a harder time speaking up report feeling increasingly more comfortable doing so, and increasingly more confident doing so. In meetings generally after stepping into one of these four special roles, while those who have an easier time speaking up, report, viewing these folks in an increasingly more favorable light, and increasingly seeking out their input more often. Which in my opinion, just create such a beautiful feedback loop. Wow. That's a lot to digest, Anything else we haven't covered. Actually, yes. One more thing I'd like to add. In its most simplistic terms. If psychological safety is the belief that we can speak up without the fear of embarrassment or the fear of punishment. Along with the additional details we just talked through. And I'm hoping that this may not even be necessary for me to say. This doesn't mean speaking without limits or in ways that utilize our power or privilege to speak in ways that are oppressive or othering to folks. You. And I both are very intentional about our dialectical worldview. We recognize that we humans are complicated imperfect beings and that seemingly opposite perspectives or paradoxes can and often do simultaneously exist. And we are both deeply committed to looking for that kernel of truth, to another's perspective. These are guiding principles that are fundamental to the way we approach our work and our lives. And these are all very much in line with the concept of psychological safety that said, I feel the need to be clear about the fact that if there was ever a question within systems that devalue and dehumanize people, there is no middle path that we are willing to This doesn't mean shaming and blaming others. It does, however, me and dismantling oppressive systems, holding people accountable for their actions. And supporting a person's basic human rights above all else. Good thing I asked as we hope you've come to appreciate so much of this is interconnected. We'll be back to recap all of these connections right after this. Support for today's show comes from our very own strengths squared, a therapy coaching and consulting practice partnering with startup founders and startup teams. At the strength squared. Our goal is not to have to treat burnout after the fact, and instead to prevent burnout from happening in the first place, we do this by equipping startup founders in their teams with the necessary skills to build sustainable mentally healthy work cultures of collective care, collective accountability, and intentional work-life integration. If you are a startup founder, a startup team member, or someone who might be a future startup founder, and are navigating a challenging topic that you would like addressed on our show. Or if you have a question you would like answered on our show. Please send an email to podcast@strengthsquared.com For a chance to have your topic addressed or to have your question answered on a future episode. Again, that's P O D C A S T. at. S T R E N G T H S S Q U A R E d.com. And we'll keep our eyes out for your topics and for your questions. Let's go ahead and pull all these connections together. To recap. If I've created a culture on my team that is truly psychologically safe, a few things are not negotiable. First, every single person on my team must genuinely believe that they are empowered to speak up about concerns and suggest ideas without these negatively impacting them in some way. Next, anyone on my team, including myself who has been around since day one. Must genuinely believe that they do not have all the answers that simply because they are doing something that's working doesn't mean that's the only way of doing it. And doesn't mean that's the most desirable way of doing it. And must be open both to new suggestions, ideas, and solutions. And open to revisiting previous suggestions, ideas, and solutions. Next everyone on my team must demonstrate a willingness to enter into conversations with an open mind. As opposed to already coming to the table with fixed beliefs around what makes for a good idea or a bad idea. And who gets to suggest these ideas in the first place. And lastly every single person on my team regardless of their job title needs to engage in behaviors that flattened hierarchy and allow folks to experience being on an even playing field when brainstorming and working through problems Thank you so much for listening to today's episode of fire to connect. And I hope this was helpful. If you've got a question you would like answered on our show. Just send an email to podcast@strengthsquared.com. That's P O D C a S t@strengthssquared.com. Or use the link in the show notes. And if you would like a chance to win a free startup coaching session which retails for $500, keep your ears out in the very next section for the instructions That wraps up today's episode. I hope you loved it. Don't forget to hit subscribe or follow on your favorite podcast app. So you don't miss an episode. And we are currently giving away our free startup coaching session. If you want to win a free coaching session. Just leave us a rating and brighter review on apple podcasts or the podcast app of your choice. And you'll be entered in our weekly random draw. This type of startup coaching session retails for $500 and can be yours for free by rating and writing a review of our podcast. Then listen in next week to see if you won it's that simple thanks so much in advance for supporting us on apple podcasts or on the podcast app of your choice Before we go, we want to leave you with this like many things. Establishing psychological safety is not a one and done thing. It requires ongoing cultivation and re-establishing along the way. Creating what Dr. Bernay. Brown re refers to as a safe container. Is done by asking your team what they need in order to feel open and safe in a given conversation. This is one of the easiest practices to implement. Yet many founders leaders and teams don't know to ask this. There are a number of things that can get in the way of psychological safety. The behaviors we've seen most often get in the way of psych safety at startups are behaviors like not recognizing judgment as such. Giving unsolicited advice, interrupting. Maintaining unclear boundaries and sharing information outside of team meetings. You know, like the meeting after the meeting that not everyone is in on. On the other hand, the behaviors that folks need from their founders, leaders and teams, whether startup or otherwise. Almost always include acknowledging and reserving judgment. Staying curious, listening, and asking questions, being clear about what is known and being honest about what is unknown. And not sharing information or experience about others that aren't yours to share. Invest 20 minutes in creating psychological safety before any discussion meeting or conversation. The return on investment is huge in terms of building trust and improving the quality of feedback and conversation. Make your intention of creating safety explicit and get your team's help on co-creating it and effectively implementing it together. Okay. That's it for us for today. Be sure to tune into our next episode. Episode 12. can't wait to connect with you Then Again, Thank you to my incredibly talented cousin, Andrew Fisher. For writing and playing the original music for the show. And from the bottom of my heart. Thank you to my amazing life partner and co-founder Marissa. For your belief in me and in the show for everything you do for our family and for strength squared, for everything you are doing behind the scenes for wire to connect. And without whom none of this would be possible. Lastly and perhaps most importantly, thank you so much to all of you who are listening for supporting us by choosing to spend your time with us, for connecting with us and for keeping an open mind and an open heart. I'll look forward to connecting with you in next week's episode and until then take good care and remember, we are all wired to connect.